Why are you interested in Dunshaughlin Workhouse?
I've grown up in Dunshaughlin and I've always passed it by. When I was a kid it was still completely derelict, before it was done up. I was fascinated with the building, it looked really creepy, there were no windows, no doors. I've always had a interest in it and wanted to know what went on there. In sixth class we had Mr. Gilligan and we had to do a project on the workhouse – that was my very first project on the workhouse!
Do you think it's important in Dunshaughlin's history, or do you think it's just a building?
I think a lot of people think it's just a building! I think it's very important, especially for a village. When you understand what went on there, why it was set up, and when it was set up to help the people of Dunshaughlin you get a better understanding of it, you appreciate it more. Architecturally it's a fantastic building – the fact that it's still standing. It's a shame to see the other two sections so derelict. There was nothing ever done on it before, and people were so interested in it. I did a talk in Dunshaughlin last year and there were 40/50 people there. It's important to keep your history and the context of where the village has come from.
What is your opinion on people residing in the workhouse?
I wouldn't live there – I think that's because I know what went on there! I don't particularly agree with making apartments out of it – I think that was one of the proposed projects at some stage. I admire the people living there because they respect it, and they've really taken care to get the original features back. They restored the wooden ceilings, and they've really taken care. I've no objection to that.
Do you think the people of Dunshaughlin overlook the significance of the workhouse sometimes?
It's not just people in Dunshaughlin, I think people in general don't tend to appreciate what is in their local area. They don't know about it and it's only maybe at a later stage of life, when they have time to do it, they have time to go looking into things. Especially in Dunshaughlin you're commuting, so you're gone at seven in the morning and you're back at seven at night, so you don't really cast your eye on it. It's just getting the information out there and shining a light on it. And I think, especially in Dunshaughlin they do appreciate their history and heritage. They do take pride in it, that's the one thing I've come across.
Do you know if there were any others uses of it, apart from the famine, the more recent history?
I'm a bit shady on the more recent history, because I didn't really do full research into it. It was set up in 1838, the Poor Law system, so it dates from before the Famine. People always associate it with the famine, but it was actually built 8/10 years before the famine and it worked perfectly fine as a means of looking after the people. It definitely became a school at one stage – the technical school was there at one stage. It was also used as a courthouse at one stage. There was the infamous Nurse Cavin trial which was also held there. There's very little information about that trial – there's only really references to it, no actual information. Around the 1990's it was bought and used as a bed and breakfast, and now it's only private accommodation. The back two sections have never been used and are completely derelict.
Was there a fire that damaged part of the workhouse?
I've never come across that. In the recent history?
I'm not sure, it's only of the rumours I've come across in the village as to why it's derelict.
I don't think there's any evidence of fire, because I've been in it. I think it was just because there was nobody living in it any more or using it and it was left to the elements. I think the roof fell down, but that was just decay in general.
How would you like to see the young people in Dunshaughlin taught about the history of the workhouse, particularly in the primary schools?
I've come across it constantly, people associate workhouses with the famine, and workhouses were not associated directly with the famine. It was 8 years before the famine actually hit. You've got 8 years where it served the poor and never exceeded capacity at all, and worked very well. I think that's important to specify that it wasn't built for the famine. People just associate it with the famine and how horrific it was, but it was never designed to deal with a disaster such as the famine. You've no idea how many people were looking for relief, and because it's associated with over-crowding and horrendous conditions, they're seen as horrible places. I'm sure they were, but they also worked extremely well outside of the famine years. I think it's wrong that people just focus on the famine years because the workhouses are given a bad press and it's unfair. They did their best as far as I, or the records, are concerned.
Other than the minute books, were there any other books of articles that you found extremely useful?
Minute books definitely are primary source because it's word of mouth. To me primary resources are key in that respect. There were very little secondary sources about it, specifically about Dunshaughlin, there was nothing. There was one book published on the Workhouses in Ireland, but it doesn't actually specify. The minute books have such a wealth of information – you could pick one aspect and write a thesis on it. I found them fantastic and they're in great condition up in Navan library. Other than that there wasn't really much written about them. I got a draft of Peter Conlan's book so I got some background information but it was on the famine in Meath rather than the Workhouse. I highly recommend primary sources – they're facts, and they're from the people.
What year did you write your thesis?
2008. I'm still on a mission to get it published! I've made it available in Navan library and Dunshaughlin library. I've also done a couple of publications in Ríocht na Mí, and a couple of lectures also.
I've grown up in Dunshaughlin and I've always passed it by. When I was a kid it was still completely derelict, before it was done up. I was fascinated with the building, it looked really creepy, there were no windows, no doors. I've always had a interest in it and wanted to know what went on there. In sixth class we had Mr. Gilligan and we had to do a project on the workhouse – that was my very first project on the workhouse!
Do you think it's important in Dunshaughlin's history, or do you think it's just a building?
I think a lot of people think it's just a building! I think it's very important, especially for a village. When you understand what went on there, why it was set up, and when it was set up to help the people of Dunshaughlin you get a better understanding of it, you appreciate it more. Architecturally it's a fantastic building – the fact that it's still standing. It's a shame to see the other two sections so derelict. There was nothing ever done on it before, and people were so interested in it. I did a talk in Dunshaughlin last year and there were 40/50 people there. It's important to keep your history and the context of where the village has come from.
What is your opinion on people residing in the workhouse?
I wouldn't live there – I think that's because I know what went on there! I don't particularly agree with making apartments out of it – I think that was one of the proposed projects at some stage. I admire the people living there because they respect it, and they've really taken care to get the original features back. They restored the wooden ceilings, and they've really taken care. I've no objection to that.
Do you think the people of Dunshaughlin overlook the significance of the workhouse sometimes?
It's not just people in Dunshaughlin, I think people in general don't tend to appreciate what is in their local area. They don't know about it and it's only maybe at a later stage of life, when they have time to do it, they have time to go looking into things. Especially in Dunshaughlin you're commuting, so you're gone at seven in the morning and you're back at seven at night, so you don't really cast your eye on it. It's just getting the information out there and shining a light on it. And I think, especially in Dunshaughlin they do appreciate their history and heritage. They do take pride in it, that's the one thing I've come across.
Do you know if there were any others uses of it, apart from the famine, the more recent history?
I'm a bit shady on the more recent history, because I didn't really do full research into it. It was set up in 1838, the Poor Law system, so it dates from before the Famine. People always associate it with the famine, but it was actually built 8/10 years before the famine and it worked perfectly fine as a means of looking after the people. It definitely became a school at one stage – the technical school was there at one stage. It was also used as a courthouse at one stage. There was the infamous Nurse Cavin trial which was also held there. There's very little information about that trial – there's only really references to it, no actual information. Around the 1990's it was bought and used as a bed and breakfast, and now it's only private accommodation. The back two sections have never been used and are completely derelict.
Was there a fire that damaged part of the workhouse?
I've never come across that. In the recent history?
I'm not sure, it's only of the rumours I've come across in the village as to why it's derelict.
I don't think there's any evidence of fire, because I've been in it. I think it was just because there was nobody living in it any more or using it and it was left to the elements. I think the roof fell down, but that was just decay in general.
How would you like to see the young people in Dunshaughlin taught about the history of the workhouse, particularly in the primary schools?
I've come across it constantly, people associate workhouses with the famine, and workhouses were not associated directly with the famine. It was 8 years before the famine actually hit. You've got 8 years where it served the poor and never exceeded capacity at all, and worked very well. I think that's important to specify that it wasn't built for the famine. People just associate it with the famine and how horrific it was, but it was never designed to deal with a disaster such as the famine. You've no idea how many people were looking for relief, and because it's associated with over-crowding and horrendous conditions, they're seen as horrible places. I'm sure they were, but they also worked extremely well outside of the famine years. I think it's wrong that people just focus on the famine years because the workhouses are given a bad press and it's unfair. They did their best as far as I, or the records, are concerned.
Other than the minute books, were there any other books of articles that you found extremely useful?
Minute books definitely are primary source because it's word of mouth. To me primary resources are key in that respect. There were very little secondary sources about it, specifically about Dunshaughlin, there was nothing. There was one book published on the Workhouses in Ireland, but it doesn't actually specify. The minute books have such a wealth of information – you could pick one aspect and write a thesis on it. I found them fantastic and they're in great condition up in Navan library. Other than that there wasn't really much written about them. I got a draft of Peter Conlan's book so I got some background information but it was on the famine in Meath rather than the Workhouse. I highly recommend primary sources – they're facts, and they're from the people.
What year did you write your thesis?
2008. I'm still on a mission to get it published! I've made it available in Navan library and Dunshaughlin library. I've also done a couple of publications in Ríocht na Mí, and a couple of lectures also.